Re: Automatic or easier tool changes for R8mills?

I use a system made by Mach-1 , which used to be sold by Acurite,
but is now sold directly by Mach-1 and through dealers.

>From: Jon Anderson <janders@...>
>
>There is a system made by, I think, Acurite, that places a pull stud in
>the end of an R-8 solid holder.

The pull stud is integral with the holders sold by Mach-1. You can't
use your existing R8 collets, etc. I asked about making a compatible
stud that could be screwed into the back of a standard R8 collet, but
was told that they had tried it and it was less reliable and less
accurate. (of course they did want to sell their own collets etc.)

>It's released by snapping the quill up
>sharply against the release mechanism which sits atop the spindle where
>a power drawbar would mount.

Not so much "sharply" , as "with considerable more force"

>There is some sort of mechanism that
>prevents it from unlocking if the spindle is turning.

Unfortunately not. Only common sense will prevent this from happening.
The spindle turning "lock-out" is on another system called "SnapChange".

>This requires
>enough room to withdraw a full length R-8 holder. I do not recall if
>pull studs can be fitting to just any R-8 shank tool or if it's a
>precision deal.

See above.

>A fairly wide array of holders is available however, and
>unlike the Royal system (which I've used and like), it doesn't involve
>an adapter between the spindle and tool holder. It can be seen at:
><http://www.angelfire.com/nj2/machineparts06A/quickchange.html>

Or at the manufacturer at:

http://www.mach-1tooling.com/index.htm


I have been using a system from Mach-1 for about a year, and I am
quite happy with it.

>There's another similar unit that predates it by quite a bit.
>I've seen this unit myself, Ed Haas (aka: Steamboat Ed) has this setup
>on his Bridgeport.

It is trully a small world. I have used Ed's mill and lathe for about
a year and a half before I got my own. So I have used both systems.

Changing tools on Ed's system is easier than on mine (less effort
pulling on the quill handle). Both require special collets.
If you look at both web sites, the similarities are surprising.

>I like this one for the same reason as the above
>system, it's directly applied to the R-8 taper. I also like the fact
>that the holders are stubby, not extending full length like a drawbar
>R-8 shank. Needs much less room for tool changes.
>It can be seen at: http://www.snapchange.com/
>
>Either of these could be the basis of an automatic tool changer setup
>for R-8, but neither provide a common reference feature for a tool
>changer to grip. More than one solution to that, I'm sure.
>
>However, solid toolholders in a collet drawn tight with heavy springs,
>is pretty simple to make, and easy to release via air or cam action.
>
>Jon


>KIM wrote:
> I know of two: the air wrench powered drawbar looseners/tighteners and
> the the Royal system whereby the R8 collet is a holder for another
> collet system.

three: Mach-1

They have their own R8 type collets with a pull nipple on the back.
To insert or remove a collet, the quill is raised all the way up,
then you pull on the quill handle some more, and it releases the previous
collet, and you can insert the new one. It takes considerable pull
on the quill handle to do this (I brace my right knee against the
mill's knee to give the leverage I need), but it then holds the collet
with apparently 600 lb force.

> I'm thinking something along the line of adding a pull nipple on top of
> the R8 collet and pulling it up with an air powered drawbar something
> like how the Cat40 system works.

So somewhat like cat40, but spring loaded rather than compressed air.

> Failing to find something that works for the R8, our next mill will
>have a Cat something taper...
>
>Thanks.

Pros and Cons:

Pros:

Easy to use.

Repeatable Z height for end mills in end mill type holders, and also
for tooling in collets, as they have a rather nice locking ring affair
that keeps a tool locked in a collet, even when not in the machine.
So when changing tooling while a CNC program is running, you don't
have to reset Z0.0 if the tool is already in some type of tool library
with the offset already entered.

Quiet (no air compressor needed) (this is in my garage, and when I am
playing at night I don't want to disturb my neighbors)


Cons:

Got to buy all the collets, and mill holders from them at $37 each.

Still manual (no automatic tool changing product)

Requires that CNC upgrade to manual mill did not remove ability
to use quill handle even if quill is also controlled by CNC.


Philip Freidin


=================
Philip Freidin
philip@...