Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Haas Mini-Mill
Posted by
Marcus & Eva
on 2001-08-23 08:40:02 UTC
Hi Carlos:
I had a good experience overall, with the Minimill so far.
It is as accurate as I want, and is sufficiently rigid to do what I need it
to do.
I did have a few surprises though.
It consumes a lot more air than I originally was told it would do. (air /
oil spindle)
The earsplitting racket from the compressor nearly drove me nuts; and that
was after I bought a monstrous (for my shop) 25 CFM compressor with an 80
gallon tank.
The Sears 25 gallon model I had before couldn't keep up at all; even though
the salesman swore up and down that I wouldn't need anything bigger than
that.
So...3 grand and change spent for a decent compressor, and another chunk to
isolate it from the rest of the shop so I wouldn't go nuts.
Other things: the footprint on this machine is BIG (for my little shop) so
it eats up a lot of space. I anticipated this, but the logistics of getting
it in and set up were daunting compared to the surface grinder of the same
gross weight that I put in a month later.
Next item: although John Stevenson states that tooling need not be a
bankbreaker, I was shocked when I added up the tab, compared to what it
takes to tool a Bridgeport.
A ten pot toolchanger, for doing toolroom type work and a bit of production
needs a helluva lot more than 4 collets.
I got 3 CAT 40 / ER20 collet chucks and about 30 collets, and I still don't
have enough!!
The tab for that purchase alone was over $2000.00, never mind the endmill
holders, drill chucks, saw arbors etc, etc, etc.
The problem is that you usually need to run more than one cutter with the
same shank size,and it's a real pain to change out tools from the same
collet chuck, because you then constantly have to reset your tool length
offsets.
Something you need to be aware of for Haas machines in general; almost
everything is an accessory with a corresponding cost.
The floppy drive, rigid tapping, coolant pump, spindle orient, all cost
plenty; in my case, the tab for the accessories cost more than a brand new
9x49" Bridgeport clone turret mill, so the quoted base price is a bit like a
quote for a new car with no wheels, doors, or engine.
Total all up tab for me to get into CNC with this machine was about
$45000.00 USD on a base price of $29,999.00 USD.
I still don't have all the tooling I need, and I'm now confronting the
coolant management problem: $500.00 for a skimmer, $20.00 per month for
anti-stink tablets, $50.00 every 6 months to dispose of spent coolant.
Quirks of the machine itself:
It is having a problem not returning to machine home reliably after
shutdown.
I found this out the hard way by scrapping out an expensive part, and the
service I have received so far to resolve the problem is somewhat cursory,
to put it politely.
The Z axis height is really marginal on this machine; you have to be ever
vigilant that you don't run the job into tools hanging out of the toolpot,
especially when the job zooms to home position when it is finished.
Drilling deep holes is a real challenge because of this; all programs need
to be manually edited if there is any risk of this kind of crash.
The chip pan is a real pain to clean out; they weren't kidding when they
called it a "mini" mill.
Rapid override on this machine can only be done in increments, and the
slowest is 5%.
I HATE this feature!!!
I prefer to be able to dial in the override to a crawl when I'm first
running a new program...5% of 600 ipm is still 30 IPM and that's too fast to
reliably avoid a crash.
The 6000 rpm spindle is too slow, but the 15000 rpm option brings the base
price up to $50,000.00 USD which is too high for what you get.
The machine is pretty accurate, but it sure ain't no Okuma!!!
I can circlemill to 0.0002" for position and roundness at 20 IPM but I sure
can't do it at 80 IPM.
In summary: for toolroom applications I have been pleased with its
performance to date.
It is a well-made machine that can take a decent cut without shaking itself
apart.
It is expensive to run, but it has been very profitable for me so far.
I would definitely do it again.
The coolant setup, and the toolchanger are definite bonuses over the
Defiance.
Cheers
Marcus
-----Original Message-----
From: Carlos Guillermo <carlos@...>
To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups. com <CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, August 23, 2001 6:39 AM
Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Haas Mini-Mill
I had a good experience overall, with the Minimill so far.
It is as accurate as I want, and is sufficiently rigid to do what I need it
to do.
I did have a few surprises though.
It consumes a lot more air than I originally was told it would do. (air /
oil spindle)
The earsplitting racket from the compressor nearly drove me nuts; and that
was after I bought a monstrous (for my shop) 25 CFM compressor with an 80
gallon tank.
The Sears 25 gallon model I had before couldn't keep up at all; even though
the salesman swore up and down that I wouldn't need anything bigger than
that.
So...3 grand and change spent for a decent compressor, and another chunk to
isolate it from the rest of the shop so I wouldn't go nuts.
Other things: the footprint on this machine is BIG (for my little shop) so
it eats up a lot of space. I anticipated this, but the logistics of getting
it in and set up were daunting compared to the surface grinder of the same
gross weight that I put in a month later.
Next item: although John Stevenson states that tooling need not be a
bankbreaker, I was shocked when I added up the tab, compared to what it
takes to tool a Bridgeport.
A ten pot toolchanger, for doing toolroom type work and a bit of production
needs a helluva lot more than 4 collets.
I got 3 CAT 40 / ER20 collet chucks and about 30 collets, and I still don't
have enough!!
The tab for that purchase alone was over $2000.00, never mind the endmill
holders, drill chucks, saw arbors etc, etc, etc.
The problem is that you usually need to run more than one cutter with the
same shank size,and it's a real pain to change out tools from the same
collet chuck, because you then constantly have to reset your tool length
offsets.
Something you need to be aware of for Haas machines in general; almost
everything is an accessory with a corresponding cost.
The floppy drive, rigid tapping, coolant pump, spindle orient, all cost
plenty; in my case, the tab for the accessories cost more than a brand new
9x49" Bridgeport clone turret mill, so the quoted base price is a bit like a
quote for a new car with no wheels, doors, or engine.
Total all up tab for me to get into CNC with this machine was about
$45000.00 USD on a base price of $29,999.00 USD.
I still don't have all the tooling I need, and I'm now confronting the
coolant management problem: $500.00 for a skimmer, $20.00 per month for
anti-stink tablets, $50.00 every 6 months to dispose of spent coolant.
Quirks of the machine itself:
It is having a problem not returning to machine home reliably after
shutdown.
I found this out the hard way by scrapping out an expensive part, and the
service I have received so far to resolve the problem is somewhat cursory,
to put it politely.
The Z axis height is really marginal on this machine; you have to be ever
vigilant that you don't run the job into tools hanging out of the toolpot,
especially when the job zooms to home position when it is finished.
Drilling deep holes is a real challenge because of this; all programs need
to be manually edited if there is any risk of this kind of crash.
The chip pan is a real pain to clean out; they weren't kidding when they
called it a "mini" mill.
Rapid override on this machine can only be done in increments, and the
slowest is 5%.
I HATE this feature!!!
I prefer to be able to dial in the override to a crawl when I'm first
running a new program...5% of 600 ipm is still 30 IPM and that's too fast to
reliably avoid a crash.
The 6000 rpm spindle is too slow, but the 15000 rpm option brings the base
price up to $50,000.00 USD which is too high for what you get.
The machine is pretty accurate, but it sure ain't no Okuma!!!
I can circlemill to 0.0002" for position and roundness at 20 IPM but I sure
can't do it at 80 IPM.
In summary: for toolroom applications I have been pleased with its
performance to date.
It is a well-made machine that can take a decent cut without shaking itself
apart.
It is expensive to run, but it has been very profitable for me so far.
I would definitely do it again.
The coolant setup, and the toolchanger are definite bonuses over the
Defiance.
Cheers
Marcus
-----Original Message-----
From: Carlos Guillermo <carlos@...>
To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups. com <CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Thursday, August 23, 2001 6:39 AM
Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Haas Mini-Mill
>Hi all -
>
>With all this talk about young John in the UK wanting to buy a big
>mill, I started thinking about big-type smaller CNC mills, like
>the Haas MiniMill. I know it's not hobby-priced, but neither were
>a lot of the machines many of us are now using, when they were
>new. Maybe in 15 years, the price of a used MiniMill will be
>equivalent to some of the cheap Bridgeport BOSSes you can now buy
>for $1500. Marcus, if you're reading this, how 'bout a report on
>your new mini-"toy"?
>
>http://www.haascnc.com/news/co_product.html
>
>Carlos Guillermo
>VERVE Engineering & Design
>
>
>
>Addresses:
>FAQ: http://www.ktmarketing.com/faq.html
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Discussion Thread
Carlos Guillermo
2001-08-23 06:38:59 UTC
Haas Mini-Mill
Sven Peter
2001-08-23 06:52:31 UTC
Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Haas Mini-Mill
Marcus & Eva
2001-08-23 08:40:02 UTC
Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Haas Mini-Mill