Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] surplus pneumatics ( was Re: Sources for belts and pulleys

Dave, thank you for the formulas, exactly what I was looking for.
Yes, all your comments are absolutely correct, but at this point of time
I'm not overly concerned with actual punching performance. This can be
scaled up
easily. More important for me is making operation of the punch and the
turret by CNC.
Regards, Alex

----- Original Message -----
From: turbulatordude <davemucha@...>
To: <CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 2:28 PM
Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] surplus pneumatics ( was Re: Sources for belts
and pulleys


> PSI times area of the piston will offer the force on the shaft, but
> leverage will be easier and offer similar force.
>
> the difference is that you trade lenght of stroke for pressure. I'm
> not sure if it costs more to make 1 cu ft of 250 psi or 4 cu ft of 90
> psi ?
>
> Either way, air will be pretty light.
>
> a 6" bore with 125 psi will offer the same force as 4" at 250.
>
> figure the crank arm for torque delivered to the work.
>
> 125 PSI is the normal working pressure of many compressors.
>
> unfortuanatly, the energy needed to punch holes is huge. it will
> take about 2.5 tons to punch a 1/4 inch hole in 1/8 steel.
>
> for a rough estimate on steel....
> hole area x thickness x 80 = tons
>
> I think you use 65 for aluminum.
>
> for a higher pressure, all you need to do is to push a 6" bore to get
> a 4" bore on the secondary to move with the higher pressure. I'm not
> sure of the compressibility of air at the higher pressures. Also, if
> you push a 4" dia for 2 inches on a lever with a seconday at 1 inch
> stroke, you will also multply the energy.
>
> Dave
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com, Chris L <datac@l...> wrote:
> > Alex,
> > That sounds pretty cool.... But, 250psi ?? That is a "lot of
> stuff"
> > behind a 4" piston. Wow. Everyshop I've been in around here, OSHA
> stepps
> > in and wants the pressure to not exceed 90psi unless the device is
> > literally "guarded to death", and with drag racers "tranny blanket"
> > wrapped around anything even suspected of a failure in the next 100
> > years. (for good reason I suppose)
> >
> > The Surplus Center catalog has a 4" diameter 4" Stroke Cylinder
> rated
> > for 250psi for $59.95 listed in their catalog. (dual acting - 1"
> rod)
> >
> > I know a few years back, I found companies doing this with
> suprisingly
> > small bore Air cylinders, but they had some "secondary" technique
> built
> > into the cylinder. I am going to dig up that old literature....
> Might
> > have been air over sealed hydraulic of some kind.
> >
> > Cool. Post pictures when that things is done. I've contemplated a
> Cnc
> > Punch press with air as well....
> >
> > Chris L
> >
> > alex wrote:
> >
> > >Folks,
> > >the reason I need this cylinder, I want to build a light - duty NC
> turret
> > >punch.
> > >It will utilize Jon Elson's Universal Stepper board and EMC.
> > >Capacity: 22 gage steel, 1/8 aluminum. Stock size: 6" x 18".
> > >Alex
> > >
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: turbulatordude <davemucha@j...>
> > >To: <CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com>
> > >Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 6:54 PM
> > >Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] surplus pneumatics ( was Re: Sources
> for belts
> > >and pulleys
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >>4" bore, how long a stroke ? what pressure ? there are lots of
> > >>cheal (under $100.00) plastic units with 4" stroke with a 60 psi
> max
> > >>pressure. but typically longer, 8-10inches used for HVAC
> > >>applications.
> > >>
> > >>Dave
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>--- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com, "alex" <telecomt@t...>
> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>Thank you, Dave,
> > >>>I'm looking for a high-bore (more then 4") or a pancake cylinder
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>plus 2 and
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>3
> > >>>position 2 way solenoid valves.
> > >>>Regards, Alex
> > >>>----- Original Message -----
> > >>>From: turbulatordude <davemucha@j...>
> > >>>To: <CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com>
> > >>>Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 5:59 PM
> > >>>Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] surplus pneumatics ( was Re: Sources
> for
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>belts
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>and pulleys
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>>e-bay offers a decent selection and it changes often enought to
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>get a
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>>good variety.
> > >>>>
> > >>>>Herbach & Raiderman, http://www.herbach.com/about.htm
> > >>>>C&H, http://www.aaaim.com/CandH/index.htm
> > >>>>MECI http://www.aaaim.com/CandH/index.htm
> > >>>>
> > >>>>all have some stuff.
> > >>>>
> > >>>>if you have some specifics, let us know so we can offer some
> more
> > >>>>approprate sources.
> > >>>>
> > >>>>Dave
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>--- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com, "alex" <telecomt@t...>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>>>Jan,
> > >>>>>what is a surplus place for pneumatic cylinders and components?
> > >>>>>Alex
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>Addresses:
> > >>>>FAQ: http://www.ktmarketing.com/faq.html
> > >>>>FILES: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO/files/
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> > >>wanliker@a...,
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>timg@k...
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>>Moderator: pentam@c... indigo_red@q... [Moderators]
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> > >>
> > >>
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> > >>>
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> > >>>>
> > >>>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jobshophomeshop I consider this
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> > >>
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> wanliker@a...,
> > >>
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> > >timg@k...
> > >
> > >
> > >>Moderator: pentam@c... indigo_red@q... [Moderators]
> > >>URL to this group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO
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> > >
> > >>http://www.metalworking.com/news_servers.html
> > >>
> > >>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jobshophomeshop I consider this
> to be a
> > >>
> > >>
> > >sister site to the CCED group, as many of the same members are
> there, for OT
> > >subjects, that are not allowed on the CCED list.
> > >
> > >
> > >>NOTICE: ALL POSTINGS TO THIS GROUP BECOME PUBLIC DOMAIN BY
> POSTING THEM.
> > >>
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> > >DON'T POST IF YOU CAN NOT ACCEPT THIS.....NO EXCEPTIONS........
> > >
> > >
> > >>bill
> > >>List Mom
> > >>List Owner
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Addresses:
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> it if you have trouble.
> > >http://www.metalworking.com/news_servers.html
> > >
> > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jobshophomeshop I consider this to
> be a sister site to the CCED group, as many of the same members are
> there, for OT subjects, that are not allowed on the CCED list.
> > >
> > >NOTICE: ALL POSTINGS TO THIS GROUP BECOME PUBLIC DOMAIN BY POSTING
> THEM. DON'T POST IF YOU CAN NOT ACCEPT THIS.....NO EXCEPTIONS........
> > >bill
> > >List Mom
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> > >
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> > >
> > >
> > >
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> > >
>
>
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>
> OFF Topic POSTS: General Machining
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aol://5863:126/rec.crafts.metalworking or go thru Google.com to reach it if
you have trouble.
> http://www.metalworking.com/news_servers.html
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jobshophomeshop I consider this to be a
sister site to the CCED group, as many of the same members are there, for OT
subjects, that are not allowed on the CCED list.
>
> NOTICE: ALL POSTINGS TO THIS GROUP BECOME PUBLIC DOMAIN BY POSTING THEM.
DON'T POST IF YOU CAN NOT ACCEPT THIS.....NO EXCEPTIONS........
> bill
> List Mom
> List Owner
>
>
>
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>