Re: Defiance VTX-1 VMC?

Thanks alot for the great info. The Machine I am looking at was
built late 99, It seems to be similar to what you are describing
except it has a tool changer, and has a pc based controller. It is
on eBay right now, and it looks like it's going to end at about 8-
9k. He claims less than 10 hours on the machine. Do you think that
is a good price for such a machine? What did you pay for yours?

Thanks

here is the ebay link:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?
ViewItem&item=3808868874&category=58252&sspagename=STRK%3AMEBWA%
3AIT&rd=1


--- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com, "Marcus and Eva"
<implmex@a...> wrote:

> Hi Pizzaface:
> I own a Defiance VTX1.
> I bought it in 1999.
> It is an earlier model with the Bridgeport DX32 control, not the

later

> Creative Evolution control.
> Here's my two cents' worth:
> The basic machine construction is OK with these caveats:
> - the head was not perpendicular to the table in either plane, and

needed to

> be refitted.
> - the tee slots are not parallel to the x axiz motion
> - the table is a hot rolled mild steel plate about 1 1/2" thick and

has

> curled 0.0007" in "X".
> - the machine is lightly built with 5/8" ballscrews and teeny linear
> bearings
> - the spindle is very simple in design, more like a router than a

heavy duty

> mill, but it does 10K all day and has been totally trouble free.
> - the pneumatic collet clamp mechanism needed to be rebuilt.
> The machine controller is easy to learn and use, and has lots of

nice

> functions like macro programming and full variable programming.
> It uses some goofy proprietary G codes that you'll need to learn.
> The controller is notorious though, for its inability to handle

acceleration

> and deceleration properly on short linear moves at high feedrates.
> This makes the machine hop around like a machine gun when you are

doing

> surfacing of convoluted shapes with lots of direction changes.
> The result is poor finish and accuracy, and an inability to do high

speed

> machining of hardened steel without trashing a lot of cutters.
> This is purely a DX32 controller problem, and Bridgeport was sued

over this

> defect in a class action suit some years ago.
> Defiance later switched to the Creative Evolution control which was

reported

> to be excellent.
> My machine came with no toolchanger, and although one was promised

by

> Defiance, I'm not sure if one was ever actually produced.
>
> On to my use experience:
> I bought the machine to do a contract I'd won for developing an

insect

> habitat for the space station.
> I have milled literally mountains of Delrin on the machine, and,

once its

> defects were corrected, it performed like a champ.
> It is lightly built, but I have nonetheless used it to mill

hardened A2 at

> 62 Rockwell C; this with a 1/2" cutter milling a 2" deep pocket, and
> although it didn't like it, it did it!!
> I can take a cut of 0.050" in aircraft aluminum with a 4 flute 1/2"

cutter

> at 5000 RPM and 30"/min without problems.
> I've milled lots of electrodes on the machine, all in Telco, and it

handles

> that very well too.
> The precision of the machine is less than stellar...it ain't no 2

tenths

> machine, but I can circular interpolate within 0.0005" if I keep the
> feedrate down and the cut light.
> I do a good bit of small routing of ABS housings for a local

manufacturer,

> and it's been brilliant in that role too, mostly because it's tiny

enough to

> be handy to get into while sitting in a nice comfortable chair.
> It's biggest limitation is the lack of a toolchanger...production

machining

> without one is a losing proposition unless your parts typically can

run

> unattended for 20 minutes or more.
> As a prototyping machine it's been excellent, again because it's

little and

> handy.
> My machine has no coolant, and I don't want any because it's my

plastics

> machine.
> Without coolant though, you can't expect to do any amount of

production

> machining in metals.
> The way covers are Gortite; I've no idea how they'd stand up to

coolant, but

> I'd suspect no too good.
> It's a good little mill, but don't expect to drill 3/4" holes in

steel with

> it; there ain't enough rigidity in the head to handle it.
> That's it in a nutshell..hope it's of some use in your decision.
> I'm not sorry I bought mine...I got a decent deal and I made back

its cost

> in the first two months I owned it.
> I still use it daily even though I've got a Haas too.
> If the machine's in good shape, and if you don't hope to hog out

big pockets

> in huge mold bases with it, it's worth owning.
> Cheers
>
> Marcus
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "pizzafacepizzaface" <boutakis@h...>
> To: <CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 1:37 AM
> Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Defiance VTX-1 VMC?
>
>
> > Hi, does anyone have any experience on a Defiance VTX-1 VMC? I am
> > looking at buying one of these puppies, and I was wondering how

good

> > it would be for aluminum and steel? How viable is it for small
> > production runs?
> >
> > Thanks