RE: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: What price all this homebrew CNC??

Marcus,

I agree with you completely if you are running a business that uses CNC
machines. However, those of us that are hobbyists or home shop machinists
may tend to find 9k to 11k way out of reach for a hobby use machine. Sure,
there are some of us that can afford these prices and that is fine, and then
there are some of us that can afford to spend that much for a machine but
choose to 'roll our own' because we can't justify the price to ourselves. I
am also sure that there are a lot of us that want CNC in our home shop but
there is no way in hell we can afford to spend that kind of money to get
there. Personally if I was going to spend that much money for a mill in my
home shop I would find a used Bridgeport BOSS with a dead control and
retrofit it to EMC with Gecko's long before I would pay $11,000 for a
$895.00 imported mill/drill converted to CNC by FlashCUT or Microkinetics.

Just my $.02 on this subject.

John Guenther
Sterling, Virginia

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marcus & Eva [mailto:implmex@...]
> Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2002 12:11 PM
> To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: What price all this homebrew CNC??
>
>
> Excellent points Ken.
> I priced out the actual costs of some relatively "simple" CNC projects and
> found that they become cost prohibitive as soon as you assign a value for
> your time.
> It doesn't even need to be a large hourly rate.
> For example, I checked out the possibility of building a 2 axis
> orbiter for
> my sinker EDM.
> Mark Fraser (from this list) was good enough to point me in the right
> direction to begin (my electronics knowledge is abysmal), and
> even provided
> me with a couple of shortie ballscrews.
> I subsequently found a used commercial model, and figure I saved about 5
> grand in labour by buying that used unit rather than doing the "roll your
> own".
> Even if I had bought a brand-new unit right out of the box, I would have
> come out ahead with a purchase rather than a build!
> I estimated my time at toolmaker's wages; not even half my regular shop
> rate.
> Course, if I was going to build a hundred of them and sell them,
> 'twould be
> a different thing.
>
> I think there are three ways you can justify doing it yourself:
> First, if you just gotta do it because it's just too much fun!!
> Second, if you're going to get something you just can't buy!!
> Third, if you've got enough of the right kind of background that
> you can do
> all of it efficiently, and have more time than jobs or money (but
> could get
> more jobs if only you had that CNC capability)
>
> For basically commercial users like myself, I can buy a
> ready-to-run machine
> for a lot less than I could ever hope to build it for.
> (Of course, that's no excuse for a company to gouge the unwary with an
> overpriced piece of crap)
>
> Cheers
>
> Marcus
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ken Jenkins" <kjenkins@...>
> To: <CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 11:58 PM
> Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: Flashcut 9000 mill and an open question
>
>
> > > Message: 5
> > > Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 15:39:33 -0500
> > > From: "j.guenther" <j.guenther@...>
> > > Subject: RE: Re: flashcut 9000 series mill
> > >
> > > I think I am in the wrong business! Let's see, FlashCUT takes a $900
> > > mill/drill and converts it to CNC with a proprietary system
> and charges
> > > $11,000 for it. MicroKinetics takes an RF-31 mill/drill,
> upgrades it to
> CNC
> > > and get's $8995 for it. For those prices the average guy could afford
> to
> > > make the conversion, learn what he did wrong, do it all over
> again with
> > > another machine and then take the wife on a trip and still be bucks
> ahead!!!
> > >
> > > John Guenther
> >
> > Well when you have a fully proprietary system you gotta recover those
> > software costs right ;-) It does raise an interesting question though
> > (other than "where to take the wife" on holiday that is ....).
> >
> > What are the ingredients of an "ideal" comparable sized system if you
> > DYI and what are the total costs? No cheating here ... i.e. "first I
> > got a great deal on a 2-year old Bridgeport at a rummage sale for
> > under $1,000." Start with something "NEW" off the shelf that is going
> > to get converted. Here's some thoughts to get the ball rolling if
> > anyone wants to play:
> >
> > 1. If you want to start with a relatively inexpensive platform it is
> > a given you're going to change out the leadscrews and nuts right?
> >
> > 2. I would want servos/encoders/Gecko drives for accuracy and speed.
> >
> > 3. CAM could be cheap with EMC (BDI with PC hardware matched as closely
> > as I could get to a existing "working" setup with hardware that matches
> > the EMC compatibility specs.
> >
> > 4. So the CAM is "not without some pain ... nothing in Linux land
> > seems to be" albeit free ... now what about the CAD frontend
> > package and integration?
> >
> > 4. You've also got the interface from the PC to the all the
> > limits/homes/Geckos/spindle& coolant relays .... and, of course,
> > those switches and relays.
> >
> > 5. You need power supplies to drive your servos, etc.
> >
> > 6. ........ ????
> >
> > How much? Granted .... not $11,000 but ... how much? Another related
> > issue is what "part" of the hobby (presuming this is strictly a hobby
> > project and cannot be considered a capital business investment which
> > changes all the rules of the game) is one interested in?
> >
> > Some people, myself included, love tinkering and building the tools
> > as much as what we make with them, other people are more interested
> > in the process of design and programming (i.e. they more want to use
> > the tools to some other "end" purpose). How long would the DYI version
> > take you to put together? In the original post above the DYI'er is
> > "the average guy", and we'll assume to be generous, with some access
> > to "tools" other than a drill and a hacksaw :-)
> >
> > Ken Jenkins
> > kjenkins@...
>
>
>
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