Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
    Posted by
    
      Jon Elson
    
  
  
    on 2004-02-13 18:46:24 UTC
  
  Mariss Freimanis wrote:
But, the accuracy when saddled with external loads and friction make the
case even worse than this.
feeling from playing with stepper motors is that their open-loop stiffness
is WAY lower than a servo system with high DC gain. Given a system
with a good deal of external friction (for instance a machine with an
Acme leadscrew) and a closed-loop control system, I might expect a
serious case of hunting. Ie. error is sensed, an offset is applied to
the motor
position to attempt to correct the position error, and at some point it
jumps past the desired position. Due to the motor's inductance, and the
possibility of some delays between the detection of the position error
and the change in winding currents, it might be impossible to make this
work at all with standard drive components. For instance, I would expect
that a Gecko 210 would be totally unsuitable for such an arrangement,
but I don't know if a 201 would do a whole lot better, with typical motors.
Have you tried doing closed-loop control with your stepper drivers?
(Not that I really think this is a great idea, just wondering. If you have
to have encoders on your motors, then going with DC brush servos starts
to look like a much better idea, and the cost difference gets much closer.)
Jon
>A step motor's ultimate accuracy is 2,000 locations (steps) perYes, we are trying to come at the same point from different directions.
>revolution. This is based on the "+/-5% non-accumulative tolerance"
>spec.
>
>Any microstep setting past 10 gives empty resolution.
>
>
But, the accuracy when saddled with external loads and friction make the
case even worse than this.
>I can think of only two reasons for using a higher resolution than 10:Although I haven't made an attempt to measure this with instruments, my
>
>1) Need smooth rotation at speeds <<1 rev per second.
>2) The motor is used closed loop with a high resolution encoder.
>
>
feeling from playing with stepper motors is that their open-loop stiffness
is WAY lower than a servo system with high DC gain. Given a system
with a good deal of external friction (for instance a machine with an
Acme leadscrew) and a closed-loop control system, I might expect a
serious case of hunting. Ie. error is sensed, an offset is applied to
the motor
position to attempt to correct the position error, and at some point it
jumps past the desired position. Due to the motor's inductance, and the
possibility of some delays between the detection of the position error
and the change in winding currents, it might be impossible to make this
work at all with standard drive components. For instance, I would expect
that a Gecko 210 would be totally unsuitable for such an arrangement,
but I don't know if a 201 would do a whole lot better, with typical motors.
Have you tried doing closed-loop control with your stepper drivers?
(Not that I really think this is a great idea, just wondering. If you have
to have encoders on your motors, then going with DC brush servos starts
to look like a much better idea, and the cost difference gets much closer.)
Jon
Discussion Thread
  
    plastiguy
  
2004-02-09 18:41:27 UTC
  stepper vs. servo
  
    bull2003winkle
  
2004-02-09 19:49:34 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-09 21:24:17 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-09 21:59:06 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Albee Tang
  
2004-02-09 21:59:07 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Roy J. Tellason
  
2004-02-09 22:35:39 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Les Newell
  
2004-02-10 00:55:07 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    John Johnson
  
2004-02-10 05:22:09 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] stepper vs. servo
  
    Peter Renolds
  
2004-02-10 06:01:12 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo - H Bridge question
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-10 07:47:46 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Stan Aarhus
  
2004-02-10 07:49:36 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-10 07:50:14 UTC
  DIY servo drive?   was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-10 08:02:47 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    bank haam
  
2004-02-10 09:47:15 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] DIY servo drive?   was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-10 11:36:49 UTC
  DIY servo drive?   was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    dchristal2
  
2004-02-10 13:32:47 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-10 16:59:46 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-10 17:02:13 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-10 17:03:03 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Roy J. Tellason
  
2004-02-10 17:51:24 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-10 21:23:22 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Roy J. Tellason
  
2004-02-10 21:42:58 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Tony Jeffree
  
2004-02-11 02:17:12 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Les Newell
  
2004-02-11 02:31:50 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Les Newell
  
2004-02-11 02:43:21 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Raymond Heckert
  
2004-02-11 19:23:21 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] stepper vs. servo
  
    Robert Campbell
  
2004-02-11 19:40:12 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] stepper vs. servo
  
    bull2003winkle
  
2004-02-11 20:35:58 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-11 20:51:18 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] stepper vs. servo
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-11 21:02:29 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-12 09:03:44 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-12 09:04:03 UTC
  microstepping   was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Harvey White
  
2004-02-12 11:44:40 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Chris Cain
  
2004-02-12 16:44:15 UTC
  RE: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] microstepping   was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    JanRwl@A...
  
2004-02-12 20:42:04 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] microstepping   was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-13 06:36:22 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    turbulatordude
  
2004-02-13 07:26:28 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-13 07:51:51 UTC
  microstepping   was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Harvey White
  
2004-02-13 08:34:30 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-13 10:11:40 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-13 10:15:17 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-13 10:59:38 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-13 18:46:24 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-14 07:46:52 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-14 07:46:53 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Harvey White
  
2004-02-14 08:43:17 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-14 12:31:32 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-15 11:45:06 UTC
  Chopper methodology was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-15 11:45:07 UTC
  Stepper Mid band resonance Help! please...
  
    jeffalanp
  
2004-02-15 12:22:14 UTC
  Re: Stepper Mid band resonance Help! please...
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-15 13:02:29 UTC
  Chopper methodology was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-15 13:22:53 UTC
  Re: Stepper Mid band resonance Help! please...
  
    zephyrus@r...
  
2004-02-15 16:33:25 UTC
  Re: Chopper methodology was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-15 17:05:54 UTC
  Chopper methodology was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    turbulatordude
  
2004-02-15 22:20:30 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo - hundreds of microsteps
  
    turbulatordude
  
2004-02-15 22:40:08 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo  - Allegro and ignoring the edges....
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-16 09:39:54 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo - hundreds of microsteps
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-16 10:48:05 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo  - Allegro and ignoring the edges....
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-16 10:52:22 UTC
  Chopper methodology was Re: stepper vs. servo
  
    jmkasunich
  
2004-02-16 14:07:51 UTC
  Re: Stepper Mid band resonance Help! please...
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-16 14:22:28 UTC
  Re: Stepper Mid band resonance Help! please...
  
    jmkasunich
  
2004-02-16 14:38:26 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo  - Allegro and ignoring the edges....
  
    jmkasunich
  
2004-02-16 14:41:11 UTC
  Re: Stepper Mid band resonance Help! please...
  
    ballendo
  
2004-02-16 15:25:25 UTC
  Re: Stepper Mid band resonance Help! please...
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-16 22:01:46 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo  - Allegro and ignoring the edges....
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-17 07:14:02 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo  - Allegro and ignoring the edges....
  
    turbulatordude
  
2004-02-17 08:09:24 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo  - Allegro and ignoring the edges....
  
    Mariss Freimanis
  
2004-02-17 09:27:33 UTC
  Re: stepper vs. servo  - Allegro and ignoring the edges....
  
    Jon Elson
  
2004-02-17 19:28:16 UTC
  Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: stepper vs. servo  - Allegro and ignoring the edges....