Re: Vectorcam, bobcad, rhino3D, which one??

Hi Mike,
thanks! Rhino does seem straight forward and it looks nice too, an
added benifit. What CAM package do you use to convert the drawing you
make in Rhino3D. I am tring out the demo right now. I am a full time
optometry student so the $195 price tag is really inviting right now!
I can wait a bit as I will be a student for one more year but am
leaning toward Rhino for my 2.5 and 3D drawings already. TurboCAD 3D
is another option (I guess).
thanks
tauseef

--- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@y..., "Mike Phillips" <mikep_95133@y...> wrote:
> I've used Rhino for a few months now. It's Excellent!
>
> Mike
>
> --- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@y..., "tauseef" <alieron@h...> wrote:
> > Hey guys (John, Tom, and Paolo + any others),
> > I am so sorry that I did not respond to your letters before! I
was
> > just doing a search on these CAD/CAM packages again and ran
across
> > these posts!! Sorry! To answer your question of what I plan to
make
> I
> > would say things like 3D name plates, parts for my radio control
> > helicopters, car and planes (these would really be more 2 1/2D),
> some
> > jewelery, possibly "artwork," business card holder for my
brothers
> > and sisters and other silly things like that. Answering that
> question
> > is really pretty hard (even though I know its very important). I
> love
> > this machining stuff and the 3D CAD/CAM package would really be
more
> > of a luxuary as I don't know how much 3Ding I truely would be do
> > considering the time involved in drawing out a 3D object.
Machining
> > is also a hobby for me and not my profession so I don't need the
> real
> > high-end stuff. I downloaded Rhino3D today and must say for the
30
> > min I have spent on it, I am impressed! Its seems very straight
> > forward. I also have the demo of vectorcam but find it quite hard
to
> > work with. Millwizard is also very impressive and I can't even
> > imagine how wonderful the higher end CAM packages must be! Would
a
> > combination of TurboCAD and Millwizard be a consideration?
> > thank you guys again for your input and I hope to answer much
> quicker
> > next time :)
> > tauseef
> >
> > --- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@y..., machines@n... wrote:
> > > --- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@y..., pavel59@y... wrote:
> > > > John, I don't want to enter the dispute about the stand alone
> CAM
> > > > packages, I agree, there're a few of them and the majority of
> > them
> > > > are very expensive.
> > > > But about the 3D side, I want to make one thing clear: CAD
> > doesn't
> > > > necessairly mean 3D and viceversa. Drawing exchange doesn't
mean
> > > > surface exchange and so far.
> > > >
> > > > C.A.D. means Computer Aided Design (Drafting), usually
> mechanical
> > > or
> > > > architectural drawing, modeling and detailing
> > > > A more recent definition like C.A.S. (Computer Aided Styling)
> and
> > > > C.A.I.(D). (computer Aided Industrial Design) label those
> > > > applications - like Rhino, Alias Studio, SolidThinking, Form-
Z
> > and
> > > > few others - which are specialized in 3D modeling. These
> > softwares
> > > > usually support specialized features for advanced surface
> > modeling
> > > > and evaluating which are not available on general purpose or
> > > > mechanical CADs.
> > > >
> > > > Some other high-end applications like ICEM and Imageware
> Surfacer
> > > are
> > > > also used in the automotive industry for C.A.S. but they
> actually
> > > are
> > > > Reverse Engineering applications.
> > > >
> > > > Rhino isn't a CAD package (ask McNeel if they would consider
it
> a
> > s
> > > a
> > > > CAD), it's a 3D surface modeler (with oustanding capabilities
at
> > a
> > > > very low price).
> > > >
> > > > DXF isn't a format you would rely for exchanging consistent
3D
> > > > surfaces, IGES, STEP and other more exotic formats are better
> > > suited
> > > > for this.
> > > >
> > > > If I was Mr. Tauseef and I had no access to the packages I
> > actually
> > > > have, but - at the same time - I really needed serious 3D
work,
> I
> > > > would consider a professional package like Rhino and would
look
> > > > around me for a CAM able to read any IGES, STEP or even a STL
> > file.
> > > >
> > > > I remember a japanese site with lot of impressive examples of
> > jobs
> > > > done that way on small personal CNC mills, modeled in Rhino
> > > (mostly)
> > > > and processed into some inexpensive CAM software.
> > > >
> > > > In 3D, the quality of the source is the most important step:
if
> > you
> > > > don't have a reliable surface to work, it doesn't matter
which
> > CAM
> > > > package will process it.
> > > > STL exchange format could be a good compromise, it gives you
the
> > > > choice for resolution/speed/time/precision you can afford and
> let
> > > you
> > > > use one of the affordable packages available today. Don't
forget
> -
> >
> > > it
> > > > has been developed for the high precision Stereolitography
> > > > prototyping process.
> > > >
> > > > Finally, about those specific CNC operations and cycles you
> > > > mentioned, I suppose you could machine your free-form
surfaces
> > the
> > > > way I suggested and then, import those mechanical features
into
> > > > another apllication which better handles them.
> > > > I feel this is a quite common procedure (at least I could see
it
> > > > being applied several times in professional machining).
> > > >
> > > > I hope my words are understandable, this isn't my first
language
> > > and
> > > > I apologize for the mistakes.
> > > >
> > > > Paolo Velcich
> > > > industrial designer
> > >
> > > Paolo,
> > > Thank you for the reply and I had no trouble understanding it.
> Your
> > > english is 10,000 times beter than my Italian?
> > > You are not entering into a dispute at all, that's what
discussion
> > > groups are for. I've left your post virtually intact and I'll
try
> > to
> > > cover the replies in order.
> > > Firstly though I don't want to appear to be knocking Rhino I am
> > only
> > > trying to give general answers.
> > > I was lead to believe that DXF files can give 3D information
> hence
> > > the DXF3D tag on some file names, Millwizard is one I believe.
> > > Obviously not all prgrams can ouput these files.
> > > Your remarks about CAS, CAI[D] and ICEM whilst being very valid
> are
> > > really out of the scope of this list which is very hobby based.
> > > The use of Rhino and a STL based cam system will give very good
> > > results as you point out but this combination will then deplete
Mr
> > > Tauseef's funds leaving him nothing left to buy another package
to
> > > handle the other milling cycles, most of which will cost the
same
> > as
> > > his initial purchase. So instead of paying $800 which I think
was
> > the
> > > mentioned figure he will finish up paying twice that for four
> > > programs, duplicating in cases what he needs.
> > > You mention that in professional machining this is done but
I've
> > als
> > > seen where a company has paid $15,000 for a CAD/CAM package,
> > realised
> > > that it doesn't suit them and are looking for another one.
> > > I don't think anyone on this list falls within this scope.
> > > We are all stabbing in the dark because Mr Tauseef laid down a
> very
> > > open ended question. Until we get clarification on his proposed
> > uses
> > > we will be split between those offering Rhino / STL Works /
> > > Millwizard / Rams/ Ampari and what I call full blown 3D CAD/CAM
> > >
> > > Come on Tauseef we are fighting on your behalf and you aren't
> > holding
> > > your end up <BG>
> > >
> > > John Stevenson
> > > Nottingham, England.