Re: EHP External Hardware Proposal

Hans, Compumotor and IMS are 2 that come to mind. It
seems that most of the RS232 driven units combine the
indexer and driver together. They use there own command
language, that you would incorporate into your own program.

Steve

----------
From: hansw <hansw@...>
To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@onelist.com
Subject: Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO]EHP External Hardware Proposal
Date: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 9:52 PM

From: hansw <hansw@...>

Steve...

OK name some... it will save me a lot of work... and what software do they
use ?

regards
Hans Wedemeyer

Steve Carlisle wrote:

> From: "Steve Carlisle" <quatsein@...>
>
> Hans, this hardware we are talking about, in general is
> called an indexer, and there is litteraly dozens of differant
> models available, from many manufacturers. They all work
> with a command list.
>
> Steve
>
> ----------
> From: hansw <hansw@...>
> To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@onelist.com
> Subject: Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO]EHP External Hardware Proposal
> Date: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 9:26 PM
>
> From: hansw <hansw@...>
>
> Steve, I just replied to your Simple Step posting...
>
> reply in text
>
> Steve Carlisle wrote:
>
> > From: "Steve Carlisle" <quatsein@...>
> >
> > Hans, thanks for the reply. There is so many possibilities
> > on this cnc hardware, it seems to confuse me at times.
> > I have seen numerous PIC/Stepper IC's but they seem to
> > operate fairly slowly (4800 baud).
>
> Lots of PIC project use PIC chip without the built in UART and the simply
> do the bit banger software UART...
> I use the PIC16C66 76 77 876 etc... The on board UART can do a very high
> Baud rate. beware of the early PIC16C73 it had a
> silicon problem and lost data above 9600 Baud...!
>
> > Am I right in that you want
> > to make an intelligent RS232 to step/direction convertor?
>
> YES !
>
> >
> > What software is out there that is compatible with RS232
> > and not propriotry? Need that knowledge!
>
> None that I know of, and I was expecting to do it myself, until Matt
> Shaver's reply.. See earlier posting.
> I correct that, last year when I was researching CNC I found a company in
> India that had a pretty neat program, 6 axis I seem to
> remember and could control
> multiple machines ALL using RS-232... When I send them a message asking

if

> the software was available for printer port output...
> they said NO...
>
> If I can find that link I'll post it ..
> regards
> hansw
>
> >
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > ----------
> > From: hansw <hansw@...>
> > To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@onelist.com
> > Subject: Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO]EHP External Hardware Proposal
> > Date: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 7:50 PM
> >
> > From: hansw <hansw@...>
> >
> > Steve,
> > I posted several replies the details of the idea.
> >
> > In reply to your question...
> >
> > I do not see it as a board in the sense of a plug in ISA or PCI card...
> it
> > would be external and controlled by RS-232
> >
> > PC-----------RS232----------------EHP-------------Exisiting Driver
> > Hardware.
> >
> > The idea is to use RS232 much like Flash Cut... but it appears

FLashCut

> > are holding their system details close to the chest...
> > I'm not interested in copying any ones idea, I can do it self...
> > See other postings about this subject ..
> >
> > regards
> > Hans Wedemeyer
> >
> > Steve Carlisle wrote:
> >
> > > From: "Steve Carlisle" <quatsein@...>
> > >
> > > It seems that most of the companys that sell data aquistion
> > > and control products list, LPT/Printer port compatible I/O
> > > systems. Would this be the type of board that would be
> > > considered for EHP?
> > >
> > > Steve
> > >
> > > ----------
> > > From: Bertho Boman <boman@...>
> > > To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@onelist.com
> > > Subject: Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO]EHP External Hardware Proposal
> > > Date: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 5:32 PM
> > >
> > > From: Bertho Boman <boman@...>
> > >
> > > More thoughts:
> > >
> > > I think Hans is going full speed but we need to talk about our goals.
> > >
> > > A few of my suggested goals:
> > >
> > > Keep it simple and do not reinvent the wheel. Make it possible for
> > persons
> > > to either use what is commonly available or easily
> > > modifiable.
> > >
> > > To make an external multi-axis, coordinated controller board is a
> > > significant undertaking. To further complicate it by adding
> > > the servo/stepper amplifiers on board would be a very large task to

say

> > the
> > > least. Besides the hardware there would be tons of
> > > software required.
> > >
> > > Doing a one channel DSP (or Micro-P) based controller like I

described

> is
> > a
> > > reasonable group project. That would separate the
> > > motion control software from the servo amplifier and the tach feed

back

> > and
> > > it would also remove the need for an expensive
> > > custom PC I-O card. Actual I-O could be either through the parallel
> port
> > > or even opto isolated RS-232.
> > >
> > > The software to drive it only needs to be modified slightly: Instead

of

> > > writing the the command to the PC I-O card D/A it sends
> > > it out on the printer port or the equivalent step speed command.
> Instead
> > > of reading the shaft encoder counter on the I-O card
> > > it reads it from the printer port. I think it would be relatively
> easy
> > to
> > > modify CNC software to do the above.
> > >
> > > That means multiple existing software could be used with slight
> > > modification since none of the timing or feedback loops are
> > > changed for the software. Only the local servo constants would be
> > modified
> > > but they are normally external anyhow.
> > >
> > > Neither Hans or I are happy to have to fiddle with Linux but if the
> > > installation and RT kernels issues are streamlined, EMC
> > > would be an excellent choice for the software. That would also

remove

> > the
> > > need to modify EMC to make it work well with
> > > steppers. An other possible alternative would be if Hans or someone
> with
> > > the right experience can take a look at what it takes
> > > to run EMC under a slightly modified NT to get reasonable RT
> performance
> > as
> > > I mentioned in a previous post.
> > >
> > > A small single channel board with PWM amps that can be used with

either

> > > steppers or servos sounds good. Hey, stack up six of
> > > them and we have a hexapod! It would solve several problems:
> > >
> > > 1. Pulse generator for steppers with no frequency limit or jumps
> > > 2. Amplifiers for plain steppers.
> > > 3. Encoder feedback for steppers.
> > > 4. Servo Amps with digital gain/ filter control.
> > > 5. Encoder, home and limit switches interface.
> > > 6. Electronic tach for servo feed back
> > > 7. No PC I-O card required
> > > 8. Easy opto isolation
> > > 9. Since it is a very low cost single channel board it can be used

for

> > > simple motion control of just about anything.
> > >
> > > To the EMC "crew": Is it practical what I suggest and would you be
> > willing
> > > to support it?
> > >
> > > Hans and Windows programmers: Have you taken a look at what is

required

> > to
> > > run EMC on NT?
> > >
> > > Who has DSP experience?
> > >
> > > Step up to the mic. Let your suggestions and comments be heard!
> > >
> > > If this is pulled through, I can have the boards built on my

production

> > > lines at cost (I'm not in this to make money) as long as
> > > we can run a reasonable size batch each time. That way, software and
> > > non-electronic persons still can be part of a large group
> > > and we can standardize our effort.
> > >
> > > Bertho Boman
> > > =======================================
> > >
> > > > From: "Carlos Guillermo" <cnk@...>
> > > >
> > > > Hans -
> > > >
> > > > I've got a pretty basic question. Are we talking about offloading
> > > > interpolation duties to external hardware? As in sending an

arc-move

> > > > command to the external micro and then letting it execute the
> > coordinated
> > > > motion? Or, are we talking about merely updating a count register
> for
> > > each
> > > > axis' "commanded position" and letting the external micro handle

the

> > > servo
> > > > loop, PID gains and all? Or, are we just talking about blind

stepper

> > > pulse
> > > > train generation...? I think I've heard a little of each from the
> > > various
> > > > people interested in this system architecture, and was just

wondering

> > > what
> > > > the external micro's duties would be.
> > > >
> > > > Carlos Guillermo
> > >
> > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor
> ----------------------------
> > >
> > > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds. Get rates as low as 0.0 percent
> > > Intro APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW.
> > > <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/NextcardCreative7SR ">Click
> > > Here</a>
> > >
> > >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Welcome to CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...,an unmoderated list for the
> > > discussion of shop built systems in the above catagories.
> > > To Unsubscribe, read archives, change to or from digest.
> > > Go to: http://www.onelist.com/isregistered.cgi
> > > Log on, and you will go to Member Center, and you can make changes
> there.
> > > For the FAQ, go to http://www.ktmarketing.com/faq.html
> > > bill,
> > > List Manager
> > >
> > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor
> ----------------------------
> > >
> > > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds. Get rates as low as 0.0 percent
> > > Intro APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW.
> > > <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/NextcardCreative7SR ">Click
> > Here</a>
> > >
> > >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Welcome to CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...,an unmoderated list for the
> > discussion of shop built systems in the above catagories.
> > > To Unsubscribe, read archives, change to or from digest.
> > > Go to: http://www.onelist.com/isregistered.cgi
> > > Log on, and you will go to Member Center, and you can make changes
> there.
> > > For the FAQ, go to http://www.ktmarketing.com/faq.html
> > > bill,
> > > List Manager
> >
> > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor

----------------------------

> >
> > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds. Get rates as low as 0.0 percent
> > Intro APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW.
> > <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/NextcardCreative7SR ">Click
> > Here</a>
> >
> >

------------------------------------------------------------------------

> >
> > Welcome to CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...,an unmoderated list for the
> > discussion of shop built systems in the above catagories.
> > To Unsubscribe, read archives, change to or from digest.
> > Go to: http://www.onelist.com/isregistered.cgi
> > Log on, and you will go to Member Center, and you can make changes

there.

> > For the FAQ, go to http://www.ktmarketing.com/faq.html
> > bill,
> > List Manager
> >
> > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor

----------------------------

> >
> > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds. Get rates as low as 0.0 percent
> > Intro APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW.
> > <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/NextcardCreative7SR ">Click
> Here</a>
> >
> >

------------------------------------------------------------------------

> >
> > Welcome to CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...,an unmoderated list for the
> discussion of shop built systems in the above catagories.
> > To Unsubscribe, read archives, change to or from digest.
> > Go to: http://www.onelist.com/isregistered.cgi
> > Log on, and you will go to Member Center, and you can make changes

there.

> > For the FAQ, go to http://www.ktmarketing.com/faq.html
> > bill,
> > List Manager
>
> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
> GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds. Get rates as low as 2.9 percent
> Intro or 9.9 percent Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW.
> <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/NextcardCreative4SR ">Click
> Here</a>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Welcome to CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...,an unmoderated list for the
> discussion of shop built systems in the above catagories.
> To Unsubscribe, read archives, change to or from digest.
> Go to: http://www.onelist.com/isregistered.cgi
> Log on, and you will go to Member Center, and you can make changes there.
> For the FAQ, go to http://www.ktmarketing.com/faq.html
> bill,
> List Manager
>
> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
>
> GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds. Get rates as low as 2.9 percent
> Intro or 9.9 percent Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW.
> <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/NextcardCreative4SR ">Click

Here</a>

>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Welcome to CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...,an unmoderated list for the

discussion of shop built systems in the above catagories.

> To Unsubscribe, read archives, change to or from digest.
> Go to: http://www.onelist.com/isregistered.cgi
> Log on, and you will go to Member Center, and you can make changes there.
> For the FAQ, go to http://www.ktmarketing.com/faq.html
> bill,
> List Manager

--------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------

GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds. Get rates as low as 2.9 percent
Intro or 9.9 percent Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW.
<a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/NextcardCreative4SR ">Click
Here</a>

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Welcome to CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...,an unmoderated list for the
discussion of shop built systems in the above catagories.
To Unsubscribe, read archives, change to or from digest.
Go to: http://www.onelist.com/isregistered.cgi
Log on, and you will go to Member Center, and you can make changes there.
For the FAQ, go to http://www.ktmarketing.com/faq.html
bill,
List Manager