Re: EHP External Hardware Proposal

> From: "Steve Carlisle" <quatsein@...>
>
> Hans, Compumotor and IMS are 2 that come to mind. It
> seems that most of the RS232 driven units combine the
> indexer and driver together. They use there own command
> language, that you would incorporate into your own program.
>
> Steve
>
> ----------
> From: hansw <hansw@...>
> To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@onelist.com
> Subject: Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO]EHP External Hardware Proposal
> Date: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 9:52 PM
>
> From: hansw <hansw@...>
>
> Steve...
>
> OK name some... it will save me a lot of work... and what software do they
> use ?
>
> regards
> Hans Wedemeyer
>
> Steve Carlisle wrote:
>
> > From: "Steve Carlisle" <quatsein@...>
> >
> > Hans, this hardware we are talking about, in general is
> > called an indexer, and there is litteraly dozens of differant
> > models available, from many manufacturers. They all work
> > with a command list.
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > ----------
> > From: hansw <hansw@...>
> > To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@onelist.com
> > Subject: Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO]EHP External Hardware Proposal
> > Date: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 9:26 PM
> >
> > From: hansw <hansw@...>
> >
> > Steve, I just replied to your Simple Step posting...
> >
> > reply in text
> >
> > Steve Carlisle wrote:
> >
> > > From: "Steve Carlisle" <quatsein@...>
> > >
> > > Hans, thanks for the reply. There is so many possibilities
> > > on this cnc hardware, it seems to confuse me at times.
> > > I have seen numerous PIC/Stepper IC's but they seem to
> > > operate fairly slowly (4800 baud).
> >
> > Lots of PIC project use PIC chip without the built in UART and the simply
> > do the bit banger software UART...
> > I use the PIC16C66 76 77 876 etc... The on board UART can do a very high
> > Baud rate. beware of the early PIC16C73 it had a
> > silicon problem and lost data above 9600 Baud...!
> >
> > > Am I right in that you want
> > > to make an intelligent RS232 to step/direction convertor?
> >
> > YES !
> >
> > >
> > > What software is out there that is compatible with RS232
> > > and not propriotry? Need that knowledge!
> >
> > None that I know of, and I was expecting to do it myself, until Matt
> > Shaver's reply.. See earlier posting.
> > I correct that, last year when I was researching CNC I found a company in
> > India that had a pretty neat program, 6 axis I seem to
> > remember and could control
> > multiple machines ALL using RS-232... When I send them a message asking
> if
> > the software was available for printer port output...
> > they said NO...
> >
> > If I can find that link I'll post it ..
> > regards
> > hansw
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Steve
> > >
> > > ----------
> > > From: hansw <hansw@...>
> > > To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@onelist.com
> > > Subject: Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO]EHP External Hardware Proposal
> > > Date: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 7:50 PM
> > >
> > > From: hansw <hansw@...>
> > >
> > > Steve,
> > > I posted several replies the details of the idea.
> > >
> > > In reply to your question...
> > >
> > > I do not see it as a board in the sense of a plug in ISA or PCI card...
> > it
> > > would be external and controlled by RS-232
> > >
> > > PC-----------RS232----------------EHP-------------Exisiting Driver
> > > Hardware.
> > >
> > > The idea is to use RS232 much like Flash Cut... but it appears
> FLashCut
> > > are holding their system details close to the chest...
> > > I'm not interested in copying any ones idea, I can do it self...
> > > See other postings about this subject ..
> > >
> > > regards
> > > Hans Wedemeyer
> > >
> > > Steve Carlisle wrote:
> > >
> > > > From: "Steve Carlisle" <quatsein@...>
> > > >
> > > > It seems that most of the companys that sell data aquistion
> > > > and control products list, LPT/Printer port compatible I/O
> > > > systems. Would this be the type of board that would be
> > > > considered for EHP?
> > > >
> > > > Steve
> > > >
> > > > ----------
> > > > From: Bertho Boman <boman@...>
> > > > To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@onelist.com
> > > > Subject: Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO]EHP External Hardware Proposal
> > > > Date: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 5:32 PM
> > > >
> > > > From: Bertho Boman <boman@...>
> > > >
> > > > More thoughts:
> > > >
> > > > I think Hans is going full speed but we need to talk about our goals.
> > > >
> > > > A few of my suggested goals:
> > > >
> > > > Keep it simple and do not reinvent the wheel. Make it possible for
> > > persons
> > > > to either use what is commonly available or easily
> > > > modifiable.
> > > >
> > > > To make an external multi-axis, coordinated controller board is a
> > > > significant undertaking. To further complicate it by adding
> > > > the servo/stepper amplifiers on board would be a very large task to
> say
> > > the
> > > > least. Besides the hardware there would be tons of
> > > > software required.
> > > >
> > > > Doing a one channel DSP (or Micro-P) based controller like I
> described
> > is
> > > a
> > > > reasonable group project. That would separate the
> > > > motion control software from the servo amplifier and the tach feed
> back
> > > and
> > > > it would also remove the need for an expensive
> > > > custom PC I-O card. Actual I-O could be either through the parallel
> > port
> > > > or even opto isolated RS-232.
> > > >
> > > > The software to drive it only needs to be modified slightly: Instead
> of
> > > > writing the the command to the PC I-O card D/A it sends
> > > > it out on the printer port or the equivalent step speed command.
> > Instead
> > > > of reading the shaft encoder counter on the I-O card
> > > > it reads it from the printer port. I think it would be relatively
> > easy
> > > to
> > > > modify CNC software to do the above.
> > > >
> > > > That means multiple existing software could be used with slight
> > > > modification since none of the timing or feedback loops are
> > > > changed for the software. Only the local servo constants would be
> > > modified
> > > > but they are normally external anyhow.
> > > >
> > > > Neither Hans or I are happy to have to fiddle with Linux but if the
> > > > installation and RT kernels issues are streamlined, EMC
> > > > would be an excellent choice for the software. That would also
> remove
> > > the
> > > > need to modify EMC to make it work well with
> > > > steppers. An other possible alternative would be if Hans or someone
> > with
> > > > the right experience can take a look at what it takes
> > > > to run EMC under a slightly modified NT to get reasonable RT
> > performance
> > > as
> > > > I mentioned in a previous post.
> > > >
> > > > A small single channel board with PWM amps that can be used with
> either
> > > > steppers or servos sounds good. Hey, stack up six of
> > > > them and we have a hexapod! It would solve several problems:
> > > >
> > > > 1. Pulse generator for steppers with no frequency limit or jumps
> > > > 2. Amplifiers for plain steppers.
> > > > 3. Encoder feedback for steppers.
> > > > 4. Servo Amps with digital gain/ filter control.
> > > > 5. Encoder, home and limit switches interface.
> > > > 6. Electronic tach for servo feed back
> > > > 7. No PC I-O card required
> > > > 8. Easy opto isolation
> > > > 9. Since it is a very low cost single channel board it can be used
> for
> > > > simple motion control of just about anything.
> > > >
> > > > To the EMC "crew": Is it practical what I suggest and would you be
> > > willing
> > > > to support it?
> > > >
> > > > Hans and Windows programmers: Have you taken a look at what is
> required
> > > to
> > > > run EMC on NT?
> > > >
> > > > Who has DSP experience?
> > > >
> > > > Step up to the mic. Let your suggestions and comments be heard!
> > > >
> > > > If this is pulled through, I can have the boards built on my
> production
> > > > lines at cost (I'm not in this to make money) as long as
> > > > we can run a reasonable size batch each time. That way, software and
> > > > non-electronic persons still can be part of a large group
> > > > and we can standardize our effort.
> > > >
> > > > Bertho Boman
> > > > =======================================
> > > >
> > > > > From: "Carlos Guillermo" <cnk@...>
> > > > >
> > > > > Hans -
> > > > >
> > > > > I've got a pretty basic question. Are we talking about offloading
> > > > > interpolation duties to external hardware? As in sending an
> arc-move
> > > > > command to the external micro and then letting it execute the
> > > coordinated
> > > > > motion? Or, are we talking about merely updating a count register
> > for
> > > > each
> > > > > axis' "commanded position" and letting the external micro handle
> the
> > > > servo
> > > > > loop, PID gains and all? Or, are we just talking about blind
> stepper
> > > > pulse
> > > > > train generation...? I think I've heard a little of each from the
> > > > various
> > > > > people interested in this system architecture, and was just
> wondering
> > > > what
> > > > > the external micro's duties would be.
> > > > >
> > > > > Carlos Guillermo
> > > >
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