Re: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: Sherline Auto Tool Changer (mill/drills too!)

----- Original Message -----
From: <mr68gts@...>
To: <CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 12:34 PM
Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: Sherline Auto Tool Changer (mill/drills too!)


> I would be more interested in the plans than anything else.
> Paul
>
> --- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com, "torsten98001
> <torsten@g...>" <torsten@g...> wrote:
> > Marketing prospective?
> > There are some sherline type machines out there
> > that include toolchangers, those machines
> > cost about $15000.- they are mostly bought for
> > educational and industrial purposes.
> > So there is a market, however to sell to
> > the Hobby market you have to be a lot cheaper to
> > make this attractive.
> > So price will be the key question here, what can
> > you make it for?
> > Most Hobby guys would probably consider this a luxury
> > item, but then if its really cool you may be able to
> > bank on the bragging rights.:-)
> >
> > For the Mill/Drill market this would be a much tougher
> > sell, because a 1/2 or 5/8 shank limitation would not
> > go over well with the brought majority.
> > But there may be a smaller specialised industrial market.
> >
> > Bottom line is to sell to the industrial market your
> > toolchanger has to be very good.
> > To sell to the Hobby people it has to be cheap.
> >
> > just my personal opinion
> > Good Luck with your venture
> >
> >
> > --- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com, "ballendo <ballendo@y...>"
> > <ballendo@y...> wrote:
> > > Peter,Sherline CNC'ers, mill/drill CNC'ers,
> > >
> > > I've got one worked out that I'm positive will work. Not too
> > > difficult to make, either...
> > >
> > > Now I'm wondering what someone would be willing to pay for an 8
> > tool
> > > autochanger for the sherline 5000 series mills? Is 8 tools
> enough?
> > >
> > > Max diameter of toolshank is 1/2, but limiting this to 3/8 would
> > > prob'ly make things less expensive overall. Is 3/8 shank
> limitation
> > > okay? Or must 1/2 shank tools be accomodated? What (shank)size
> > > holders do you NEED?
> > >
> > > Shop air would be needed, so is requiring an air compressor okay?
> > >
> > > Do you want to buy it complete, or make it from plans/kit?
> > >
> > > What would you be willing to pay for a complete, bolt on unit?
> > > A kit of parts?
> > > Plans?
> > > Which of these three options is most "real" for you?
> > >
> > >
> > > If you make it, you will need the sherline lathe also (or some
> > other
> > > lathe of similar capability) Is this going to be a problem? If
> so,
> > > would you be interested if the kit had the lathe parts already
> made?
> > >
> > > BTW, no mods to the mill need be made... This is a bolt-on-and-
> go
> > > item.
> > >
> > > The unit I have designed will scale to mill/drill operation as
> well:
> > >
> > > Same questions as above, but max shank diameter can easily be
> 1/2.
> > Is
> > > 5/8 necessary ?
> > >
> > > The lathe parts could probably still be made on a sherline, but
> a
> > 7x
> > > or 9x size would make things easier...
> > >
> > > So sherline and Mill/drill users, please let me know what your
> > > answers to these questions are???
> > >
> > > Thank you in advance,
> > >
> > > Ballendo
> > >
> > > P.S. Reply offlist, if you want to preserve your "lurk status"
> > here<G>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com, "Peter Cruickshank
> > > <crankshaft_sg@y...>" <crankshaft_sg@y...> wrote:
> > > > Ballendo;
> > > >
> > > > Now, we're getting somewhere !
> > > >
> > > > Hmm, you're right, the sherline collet is 'handy' cos it ready
> > made
> > > > and seems like the logical choice, but the spindle locking and
> > > > undoing the holder is a problem, you're right that it would be
> > very
> > > > difficult to undo, that was at the back of my mind, I guess I
> > just
> > > > did not want to acknowledge it !!!
> > > >
> > > > The current morse 1 taper limits the collet and cutter size as
> it
> > > > assumes that the cutter will locate inside the spindle, but
> > there's
> > > > no reason why an adaptor can not fit on the end on the spindle
> > and
> > > > interface to a quick change tool, I think there would still be
> > > > sufficient Z travel even with an adaptor on the end of the
> > spindle.
> > > >
> > > > We have gone through the first rule of troubleshooting which
> is
> > to
> > > > elimante what it isn't (can't be done) now we only have to
> find
> > > what
> > > > can - so it should be plain sailing from here on in :-)
> > > >
> > > > PeterC
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com, "ballendo
> > <ballendo@y...>"
> > > > <ballendo@y...> wrote:
> > > > > Terry,
> > > > >
> > > > > Most fully automatic changers use a similar technique.
> > > > >
> > > > > Tools are held in vee-shaped non locking single taper
> holders.
> > > > There
> > > > > is a retention knob at the top of the holder, which is the
> > small
> > > > end
> > > > > of the vee shape. Fingers inside the spindle are designed to
> > > > capture
> > > > > this knob and pull it upward (often using belleville washers
> > for
> > > > > the "drawing in" force). The interior of the spindle is
> shaped
> > so
> > > > > that thes fingers lock in a failsafe way (as long as the
> > > retention
> > > > > knob doesn't break of where it screws into the holder...
> Yes,
> > it
> > > > > happens).
> > > > >
> > > > > To change tools, hydraulic or air pressure is used to
> compress
> > > the
> > > > > belleville washers, which drops the fingers a bit, which
> allows
> > > > them
> > > > > to come out of the failsafe recess, which lets them release
> the
> > > > > retention knob, which allows the holder to drop out (into a
> > > > > waiting "transfer arm", or into the lazy susan itself.
> > > > >
> > > > > Hope this makes sense,
> > > > >
> > > > > Ballendo
> > > > >
> > > > > P.S. Do a search of "CAT 40 holder", to see one of these
> holders
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@yahoogroups.com, "James Owens"
> > > > > <wotisname@l...> wrote:
> > > > > > Hi Peter,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > This is the bit I'm asking about. I'm a where how manual
> > change
> > > > > millers hold
> > > > > > the tooling/holder in place. I have a Bridgeport type
> > machine.
> > > > The
> > > > > question
> > > > > > is how do auto-changers, when they are fully automatic,
> hold
> > > the
> > > > > tooling in
> > > > > > the spindle. I can change a tool in a few seconds but I
> have
> > to
> > > > be
> > > > > there to
> > > > > > do it. So if it is necessary for me to tighten a draw-bar
> why
> > > > use an
> > > > > > auto-changer when the tooling held in a lazy-susan would
> do?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > The sherline tool holder simply screws into the spindle
> on
> > a
> > > > high
> > > > > > > precision thread & shoulder. There's a 3mm hole in the
> tool
> > > > holder
> > > > > > > which allows you to locate in the holder to unscrew it.
> > > > Sherline
> > > > > > > claim that as the thread and location hole for the
> cutter
> > > > shank
> > > > > are
> > > > > > > created without removing the piece from the machine,
> that
> > the
> > > > > > > accuracy is very high !
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I know that full size CNCs use a draw bar to pull the
> tool
> > > > holder
> > > > > up
> > > > > > > against the taper and locate it onto a dog, but I am
> trying
> > > to
> > > > > think
> > > > > > > of a way of using the existing available stuff.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Another way would be to make an adaptor to fit the
> Spindle
> > > and
> > > > > then
> > > > > > > make special tool holders to fit the adaptor.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Regards,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Terry
>
>
>
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